Category: News and Views
on the news today, the youngest mother is 11?
aparently she got drunk and she didon't know what she was doing
yes...rite
Arent you judgemental.Is there any chance that the girl could have been RAPED!.
Not raped no Goblin. She was drunk but doesn't claime rape. The lad in question is 15 and I believe he has been arrested and charged with having under age sex. The girl in question apparently already has a 20 a day smoking habbit which is ludicrous for an 11 year old. Without knowing absolutely all the facts it does sound as though this is a sad case of parental neglect. I'm sure this could have been avoided if the parents in question had taken any interest in their daughter's upbringing. I can't imagine that they can have been taking any care at all if they didn't know that, at the ripe old age of 11, she is already drinking, smoking heavily and having sex. It is deeply saddening.
HOld on, shouldn't the girl also be accused of having under age sex?
Wow. This is so sad. It makes you wonder what kind of environment this young girl is being raised in.
Well, I must confess B that that is the first question that came to me as well. Especially when you take into account that, while this boy is being charged with a crime, the young girl has sold her story to the Sun news paper. It some how seems totally wrong to me that she should be profiting from what's happened while the boy could potentially be in a lot of trouble.
Of course it could be said that the young girl was so young that she didn't know what she was doing while the boy is considerably older. Personally though I can't help but think that these sorts of excuses are a total cop out. The whole situation just seems like one big mess to me though. So many questions and very few answers unfortunately. Why was the girl aloud to drink, smoke and have sex by her parents? As I said in my previous post, I simply refuse to believe that the parents could have had no idea. God I even heard on the radio the person who did the interview with her for the Sun paper saying that the girl sat there, in front of the reporter and smoked 3 cigarettes while outlining how she was going to bring her child up.
I don't know the answer frankly. All I do know is that the West Lothian area of Scotland will soon be boasting Britain's youngest mother. A Twelve year old.
the reason she hasn't been charged is because the boy is 't charged with having sex while under the age of 16, he has been charged with having sex with a minor, and the same law does not apply to girls as to boys. if a 16 year old boy has sex with a 15 year old girl, it is considered statutory rape. If a 16 year old girl has sex with a 15 year old boy, no action is taken. there's no logic in that.
personally I think the girl should be taken into care as her parents are clearly incapable (mother has 6 children), and the baby should be taken and given up for adoption. That's harsh I know, but maybe if something was done and these young girls had their babies taken away they would be more careful, and less boastful about having underage sex, plus, I don't care what anyone says, but at age 12 you are not fit to raise a child.
Wow, it's definitely quite sad. I heard that a 9 year old girl in Brazil got pregnant by a 17 year old guy in the early 90s but it's probably just an urban legend.
What I did see, I believe on BBC, 2 years ago was a girl from Austria who was 15 and had slept with over 150 men and her parents claimed they had no idea until they read her diary.
Now that's messed up.
That being said, and back to the original story. I agree, the whole situation is pretty sad but I feel if both kids are under age they should be held equally responsible, unless there was any proof that the boy forced the girl into this, and it really sounds like he did not. She sounds a bit like Vicky Parler <grin> for those who watch/listen to Little Britain.
So sad it's almost funny.
ah but b should they both be held responsible? or should they technically both not be charged. after all, they have had sex under the age of consent, so, according to the law, they are neither of an age where they can consent to having sex. Technically, the boy wasn't able to consent either, so why should he be charged?
Both of these children are old enough to know what they are doing. I think that if one is going to get in trouble, then the other one needs to as well, unless of course, it was forced upon one or the other, which in this case, it doesn't sound like that's the case at all. I also believe that if this young girl's parents have other children, then they should be taken away from them immediately.
SB, I totally agree with you, the way I see it it takes two to engage in sexual activity, if it is not forced upon either of the parties and they willingly participate and they're equally illegal they're equally at fault.
I guess there could be a different distinction, say 12 years of age, that results in a stronger punishment but that would kind of start blurring the line between legal and illegal.
I would find it very sad if the boy got in big trouble but the girl simply made money of selling her story to the newspapers.
this is just depressing, i can't believe parents can be so neglectful!
sometimes i just have to wonder why some people even have children if they totally refuse to bring them up right!
I think, at least in our discussion here, we have the wrong criminals. The true criminals here are the parents who have primary responsibility for their children, and society, which has a responsibility to all of its citizens.
Just my thoughts.
Bob
Bobby you are right though a
15yr old lad is old enough, to realise the outcome of his actions.I can fill you in with the details.The boy is expected to appear at Edinburgh Sheriff Court on petition, on February 23rd, charged with rape. He has been released on bail with a condition not to approach the girl. The girl's Mother and I use the term very loosely, said she is proud of her violent, chain smoking, alcohol swigging daughter, and she can't wait for the birth.The case would be the subject of a child protection review and the matter would be reported to the procurator fiscal.The girl gives birth next month-- four months before her 13th birthday.
Gemini I think from reading news reports that the girl was willing.However, she was very drunk,and the boy took advantage of this I can only hope that her child is taken from her the minute he/she is born and Scotland is spared another potential rapist.
the 15 year old has now been charged with rape
Well, in Germany, there is also an eleven-year-old girl with a baby. And her parents ... they were shocked at first but now they accept it. And as for the other case ... can a girl in that age be accused at all? In Germany you can only be accused for something from the age of 14 on. Before that, well ... it#s the parents' fault!! I have to agree with Dan.It must be a parental neglect. I mean, my mother had started smoking when she was 13. But with 11 ... this is pretty bad.
Oh, I definitely agree that the parent sneed to be held responsible as well, and, yes, the baby most definitely needs to be taken away from this child. Look at how this child is. A smoker, drinker, promiscuous... It would be very, very sad for her to be allowed to keep this baby, and to more than likely raise it the same way she was raised.
I think that to refer to a 15 year old boy as a potential rapist is perhaps a bit harsh, yes he had sex with an underage girl, but he too is underage, she has said she was willing and it was not her first time. I imagine nothing will be done, the parents will raise the child and history will repeat itself, if she has a daughter, that daughter will become a young teenage mum and so on, sadly this happens so often - remember reading about a woman who had become a grandmother at age 30, she had a daughter when she was 15 and the daughter did likewise.
If a girl gets drunk in this country, and a boy has sex with her, unless he can prove he's got her concent, he's a rapist according to recent legislation. I think that her parents are so irresponsible that they'll blame the boy and not accept any responsibility. I think all of their kids should be taken from them, I believe she's got a very young brother. She should also have her child taken from her. In answer to the post from galileo, unfortunately anyone can have children. I think it should be illegal for anyone to hae kids without a licence, at least with licencing, we'd know who was raising people and we could have very strict tests to determine who is potentially incapable of bringing up their kids properly. What kind of parents react to their child getting pregnant by getting her to sell her story to the sun? Apart from that though, she's had problems for over 2 years now. I cannot believe that social services and the school didn't know. Their failure to react has allowed things to get this bad. Also In Scotland, sex education isn't brilliant either, hence her beliefs about not getting pregnant.
ww in theory saying people should have to have a licence to have children would be great, but in reality it wouldn't work, who would decide who was/wasn't fit to have children, there are some that believe the disabled should not be allowed to have children for example, some who think that gays shouldn't be able to have children, or obese people ... who would be the ones qualified to decide?
Well I have to agree with you, Wayne. Even if it is not clear that the child will be happier in a home forchildren than with its parents.
I just can't believe the girl's mother was actually proud that her daughter is having a baby at 11 years old. I have an 11-year-old cousin, who I know, has absolutely no chance of getting pregnant and not being marched straight down the hospital for a termination by her mother, who's in her mid 40's. My mum wouldn't be very happty if I willingly and without thinking twice, slept around, had sex, smoked and got myself pregnant at such a young and more often than not, imature age as 11. If that'd happened to me, I'd now have a 12-year-old daughter. As it was, I moved up to secondary school, scraped 3 or 4 GCSEs in Music, English and German, went on to College and did GNVQs in Business Studdies, Business Admin and Health And Social Care and Keyskills level 1 and 2 and I'm still free, single and looking for a job. This girl won't be able to do any of that now. She's thrown her life away.
agreed, but I think that a lot of this has to do with social background and education and intelect. Call me a snob, but I bet the mother is on benefit, lives in a council house, has no partner and her 6 children are by different men. Of course that is a sweeping generalisation and by no means implies that people who live on benefit and in council accommodation are all unfit parents whose children drink, smoke and have sex, but there is a lot of evidence to suggest that people who come from a more socially deprived background are less educated and are more likely to become involved in drugs, crime, and underage sex.
Iternity we are all well aware of the charge. Gemini I hate to dash your hopes, but it looks as if this horror-child will be allowed to keep her baby, as she is being removed from her home into a unit for young mothers, for her own safety, by social services where were they earlier eh?!.
What was this child's school like, not putting a huge emphasis on sex education.
Jenny, I totally agree with you. She has messed up her own life. Unless they are takig the child away from her.
The teenage mum is now likely to removed from her home permanately as the social services now have photographic evidence, of HER mother smoking heroin. Gemini I wasn't yelling at you, just at the inadequacy of the people who are supposed to help...sorry for losing the plot.
BL. I think the girl's sex education was overseen by her mother, I dread to think what it consisted of.
Oh no, Goblin, I didn't take what you said as yelling at me. I didn't take it that way at all. I agree with you. Indeed, where were the social service people before all this happened? They are present now, but unfortunately, it's too late. damage has already been done. It's so sad. How about this girl's siblings? Will they be taken away from the mother as well?
Hold on folks, eehm, the girl is what, not even 12 yet. Generally sex eduaction is not on the school agenda until 6th or 7th grade, possibly 8th, you must remember she's way younger than children on average when they engage in sexual activities (16 or 17) going into sex ed with them this early is not even necessarily a good idea since it might be sending the signal that it's ok and natural for them to start thinking about sex and engage in such activities and I can say with absolute conviction, call me conservative, that kids at the age of 12 are not and should not be busy sleeping around or even thinking about it, another 3 to 4 years makes a lot of difference in the world of a teengare and one must find the right time to communicate this new aspect of life to him/her.
cheers
-B
I agree, Wildebrew. A twelve year old should not be having sex, but I do know that there are some schools who are starting to teach children about sex ed, even earlier than what they used to. I'm not sure if that's a good thing, or a bad thing. I think it goes both ways. I mean, like you said, it could possibly catch the children's interest in sexual activity, and thus, encourage them to go and try it, but on the otherhand, it could also help them to learn about it, and all the consequences it holds, if they do partake in sucha nactivity. If someone was to ask me if I support teaching sex ed at such a young age, I honestly don't know what my reply would be. I'm torn between the two choices.
Gemini thank you mate eh I can only surmise that the remaining children will be removed as their personal safety is at risk. And I agree with you, sadly the SS are invariably too late in acting, the number of children living with addict parents in Scotland is only now being revealed, and the statistics are shocking.
b, the issue is that so many people are being exposed to these sorts of things at an early age because of the things they're watching on tv and in moovies...so shouldn't they at least be warned at an earlier age?
I did hear on Radio 4 this morning that schools are largely ignoring sex ed, it was recommended that schools focus on how to identify sexual abuse and how to help or prevent it. Also,how to identify a potentially abusive partner. The nanny state may recoil with horror, but this is vital, and if my son isn't learning it then I will want to know why. Galileo I agree completely I see nothing wrong with children learning from trained professionals, before they have had the opportunity to hear it from their friends ect...Or their parent's embarrassment makes it impossible.
absolutely Goblin, not to mention that it's just fact that we must face that children are losing their inosence at an earlier age and we must move with the times to prevent this very thing from becoming common occurance. All this abstonance crap they're teaching is a load of crap, children will experament anyway, in fact, teaching kids not to have sex is very likely to encourage them to go out and have it anyway, so we must accept that kids will have sex...but we must teach them the safest ways to do so.
Agreed and I have never seen the point of abstinence on the grounds that sex is filthy or sinful ect, what damage does that do to a child's self image. They should be allowed to explore to a degree and ask questions, especially now, when there is still a pervasive no we cant discuss it, attitude to sex education with children.In my view it's causing the teenage pregnancy rate in this country.
Most deffinitly Goblin, also that so many parents seem to not have the time to explain it to their children, or they don't want to, so they go and find out for themselves.
But that's just saying to any kid on the block under the age of 16, of course you can have a baby, you're perfectly able to cope with it, so just have it off with the next person who comes round the corner and get on with life as best you can, with no qualifications to get a job, no O levels or anything, just a screaming toddler to push round in an umbrella-folding stroller, odd socks, broken toys and eczema, and no partner around to support these young girls.
Absolutely not!
what it says is, ok, we admit that you're most likely to see this on tv, or read about it, or hear how good and cool it is by one of your little friends, so what we'll do is teach you how to do it properly and how not to get pregnant, there's a big big difference!
Sad!
Wow, so many thoughts go through my head as I read this subject. If that girl is a chain smoker, I don't even like to think of the damage she did to that child. Anything could have happened.
Would the girl still have been allowed to go to school, even though she was drinking alcohol, smoking and about to ave a child? I read something a few years ago about a girl who had twins when she was 13 and the boy was older than 16, but neither of their parents cose to do anything about it and the girl didn't see the boy or get any support from him after that. I read that her mum was very supportive. Mind you, that was a story in a magazine that the girl had written herself.